S2 EP8: Breaking the Norm: Why Dena Farash Chose Homeschooling and Beyond

Herb: 00:00:19

Today, I have the pleasure of introducing Dena Farash. Dena shares sameness and sanity so that moms can feel cool, calm, and confident without guilt or shame.

She is a positive discipline at parent educator, a public speaker, author, and successful online entrepreneur who has found her unique way of sharing how to thrive in motherhood while still creating personal fulfillment, accomplishment, and connection with others.

Happily married and a mom of three, Dena loves to share with women how they can become the best version of themselves while raising the best version of their kids. Using tools like meditation, mindfulness, and grit, Dena has established herself as a strong voice in both motherhood and online business spaces.

When not working or spending quality time with her family, you can find Dena at the gym with her girlfriends or eating ice cream, which she loves and will never, ever give up, ever. Welcome, Dena. It's a pleasure to have you here. Looking forward to this conversation.

Dena Farash: 00:01:16

Thanks so much for having me, guys. I'm excited to be here.

Kristina: 00:01:19

Okay, the first, most important question then. What's your favorite flavor of ice cream?

Dena Farash: 00:01:23

Oh, that is a good question. So I. Outside of the base flavor, I really like ice cream with things inside of it.

So like a moose tracks or a cookie dough, anything that adds extra texture to the ice cream is. Is kind of where I. Where I start.

Kristina: 00:01:39

That's a great place to be. Yeah. I mean, anything raspberry is definitely on my schedule. Right. But I like that, too.

When you add in the chocolate chunks or the mint chocolate chip, all those kinds of things, those are great flavors. You have a favorite flavor today?

Herb: 00:01:52

You know, I'm. I'm human. My. My favorite flavor changes all the time during the day, so it's like, you know what? I like this today. Oh, I want that today.

But I usually don't get a lot of ice cream anymore because of my dietary restrictions. And. And that's pretty okay.

Dena Farash: 00:02:08

Yeah, well, variety is the spice of life. They actually have a great machine called the Yonanas machine where you can make ice cream out of bananas. It's pretty awesome.

Herb: 00:02:18

I like the sound of that. She's not a banana person.

Kristina: 00:02:22

No bananas. But anyway, why did we have you on the show?

Well, you know, we had a really great conversation, and I knew that because of your experiences as a parent coach, as an empowerment mom, empowerment person, and the story of you and your.

With their education experience, it would be a great way to share with our audience about how some of this flexibility, as well as this grit of working through challenges would be a great show for them to have. So that is why I asked you to come and join us today. So talk a little bit, first of all, though, about your passion.

How did you get into the mom empowerment space and really trying to help moms kind of make it through all of this that's going on with them?

Dena Farash: 00:03:00

That's a great question. And my honest answer is the way I got into the parenting space and being online is that I lost my mind as a mom.

And what I realized that I could do well was just share and articulate what was happening in my real life. And once I had the courage to start doing that in the online space, I started to build out communities and things like that.

But I always approached this type of sharing not as an expert, just as a mom who was saying, hey, right now, where I'm. Where I am in life and my parenting, it doesn't feel good. And these are the things that I'm trying to help them feel better.

Kristina: 00:03:36

Yeah.

Herb: 00:03:37

Well, that's a good, honest answer. What's your high. Flu. Flu. Not honest answer.

Dena Farash: 00:03:42

Well, yeah. I mean, it was a mission that God put me on that I never could have real. And that's actually true, too, that I never really could have anticipated.

And it wasn't until the birth of my second child where I really started to struggle a lot. And so I still say to this day that his birth was the greatest gift in my life because it was the catalyst for my own personal growth. Right.

I knew that. I knew that my home life wasn't feeling good. And the uncomfortable conversation I had to have with myself was in recognizing that I was the problem.

Right. But the powerful piece of that was understanding then that I could also become the solution.

Kristina: 00:04:20

I love that. Yes. Because as moms, as parents, as people who are trying to raise children, we do have to recognize when we are actually the issue. Right.

When we're the ones who are really struggling, when our kids might be fine, our husband might be fine. But then all of a sudden, we're like, y, this isn't working for us.

And to take that step and really take charge of that and then turn it around in our families. Thank you for saying that.

Because, you know, especially right now in our social climate, I mean, I just talked to a friend last night, and she's struggling so hard, and it doesn't have necessarily anything to do with the outside world, but it's her trying to really deal with what she's. Where she's at and what's happening in her life. And so. Thank you. Yeah. Taking charge of yourself so that you can be best for others. Yeah.

Dena Farash: 00:05:06

Yeah. And Listen, it doesn't feel good to recognize that we're the problem in our home or with our children's education or whatever it may be.

But when we are brave enough to flip the mirror and understand. You know, in my life, it wasn't my children. My children were babies. It wasn't my husband.

My husband was getting up and going to work every day so that he could provide for us if the issue was solely inside of me. And. And because I'm the mom, right? Because I, I. The. The focal point, the emotional and the energetic focal point in my house, I was.

It was spilling out onto everybody else.

Kristina: 00:05:39

Yeah. And that is so, so very important. But the best thing is that positive growth mindset, Right. I can make a change. I can make things better.

I can face things full on. Like you said in your bio, the grit. Right.

And that's what a lot of people are missing, is that grit to keep going when things are really, really hard. But what a beautiful role model that is for your kids, because when they see that grit in you, then they can face those harder challenges as well.

Herb: 00:06:08

It's kind of funny because right now it's like, I really feel like I shouldn't jump into this part of the conversation because the stuff that I say would probably be more humorous than necessarily on point or anything.

But, you know, there's been a lot of times where it's like, guys can recognize what's going on and don't have the power or the necessarily the ability to say anything because if we did, things would get so much worse. And so, you know, I'm not really sure what to add here, but, you know, tread carefully, guys.

Dena Farash: 00:06:42

Yeah, well, you know, I can resonate with that because I know that my husband was stuck between a rock and a hard place where he just wanted our home to be happy, too. But he knew that at any moment he could be saying the wrong thing, and that wrong thing would. Would the react.

My reaction to that wrong thing would be explosion. Right. And so he wanted to help and support as much as he could, but he didn't really have the right words. It was really a journey.

I had to go down myself.

Kristina: 00:07:09

Yeah. I think the biggest part at this point is, like you said, the support, just maybe the silent.

The silent support, you know, the extra hug, the, hey, is there anything I can do to kind of help those kinds of things? That really just is huge when we are in that space. Right. But guys go through it too.

You know, wives need to turn around and look at their husband when they're going through a hard space. How can you be that support?

Herb: 00:07:34

Well, because even that gentle. Hey, do you need some help? Can trigger what you think. I need help, so.

Kristina: 00:07:40

Right.

Herb: 00:07:41

So I, I, like I said, it's like, it's. It's very individualized and. And it is a very. It's a minefield at times because.

Kristina: 00:07:47

Yeah.

Herb: 00:07:49

So I'm not sure how. Like I said, I'm not really sure because there's not like a general kind of a tip that I can.

I can give or even bring up here other than to, you know, hopefully, you know, your wife well enough to. To navigate and to, again, be supportive without making an issue of it, I guess.

Kristina: 00:08:06

Yeah.

Dena Farash: 00:08:07

Yeah. You know, it's interesting, and. And I. I don't.

I don't know what road we're gonna go down with this, but what I finally recognized and when I was struggling the most, I. I never saw it, but what I finally was able to recognize the invisible load that my husband carries. Right. As the provider, as the protector.

And when I was. When I was having my tough moments, it wasn't about him at all to me. Right. So I lost that perspective.

I lost those moments of appreciating him, of seeing the blessings of our mostly state, mostly stable, except for me, home. Right. The fact that we had healthy children, I just lost sight of all of that.

And so when I was willing and able to do the work for myself, I was able to appreciate so much more, everything that my husband goes through as well.

Kristina: 00:08:54

Yeah. Thank you. Can you. Can you. Oh, Jean Dong. What was I asking? Oh. How many years have you been married? How long have you been together?

Can you share that with us?

Dena Farash: 00:09:02

We've been together for 16 years and married for 11. We have three kids ranging from five to 10.

Kristina: 00:09:10

Yeah. So. Yeah.

So it's, you know, those ups and downs through that 16 years and just really knowing each other and still making that commitment of sticking together. So we've been together. Well, married 33, but together 35. So it's the same kind of thing. You know, there.

There have been times that we aren't exactly cohabitating very well together, but then other times that we're very, very appreciative of each other, but it's that commitment of making it work and helping it get out the other side that is really amazing.

Dena Farash: 00:09:37

Yeah. Yeah. And. Right. And I see it all the time. I.

I didn't have this as an example in my own own childhood, but I am just so grateful that my children get to live this. Live this, and Witness it, You know, witness partnership.

Kristina: 00:09:51

Yeah, exactly.

And that's actually where we're kind of pivoting to next, is that as we were talking about your ups and downs and trying to take care of all of us, you decided to do some different things with your kids for schooling, for education. And that's where I wanted to go.

Is that because, you know, we very much support families making the best fit choice for their child and their education and their family situation up into, including, and hopefully homeschooling, because we know that there's so many things that are out there that are giving bad influences who, you know, are having a rough time for our kids to be really successful in the education system right now. Right. Not saying that there's not great teachers out there, but in the overall system, it's really, really rough.

So talk about that journey a little bit, because I know you said that your kids were in public school and then you kind of did something different, and now they're kind of back, if I remember right.

Dena Farash: 00:10:44

Yeah. We have. Well, mostly me, with this very strong support of my husband, we have made some extreme decisions.

My oldest did attend kindergarten and public school, and we recognized very quickly that that wasn't the right choice for our family, and it wasn't an institution that we wanted our children to grow up with, especially foundationally when it came to their education.

So after her, after my oldest first year in kindergarten, we did pull her from the district and we decided not to enroll our second child in public school either. And we went down that journey of figuring out, what does homeschooling mean? What does it look like?

Where do we find community and connection and resources? And so we spent about a year doing, figuring out, exploring homeschooling for ourselves. And then we wound up.

We wound up working with an alternative learning center where my children could go and learn and be in community for a few hours a day or a few days a week. And we. We really collectively figured out a flow that worked for us at the time.

But as you mentioned, this is the first year ever all three of my children actually are back in public school.

And that was a tremendous, tremendous adjustment for me as well, and one that I, as I do, one that I approached kicking and screaming and resisting, still understanding that at least for this temporary moment, this was the best choice for our family and just giving, giving up, you know, some of. Some of the resentment that I had towards the public school system for many, many years.

Herb: 00:12:23

Yeah, yeah. So, you know, she talks again inside of the box about the education system because she was in it for 27 years.

And while she got out for the stuff that I saw and the problems that I see, which was the completely brokenness of the system, the way they're not necessarily teaching your children how to learn, they're teaching them what to learn. They're pushing towards tests without, towards mastery, so the kids don't have to figure out or learn what's going on.

They just have to figure out how to get through the next test. And so, you know, those kind of things were like, our children aren't getting what they're needed.

So, you know, and, and I'm being really polite here as well because I, I really talk about how broken the system is, and it's not necessarily the teachers, but there are also a lot of teachers who are coming in now who don't know how to teach, who just know how to again, turn the page, read the sheet, put the kid, put it in front of the kid. So, you know, I, I see that as well. And that's kind of why we, we actually help parents pull their kids out of school and get on that track.

So like you said, you had to do a lot of learning the first year. We help shorten that so that they don't have to go through that alone and figure it all out themselves, which is bad. Yeah.

So why, how did you, why did you, why are they now back in school? And what was, what was that in your family that allowed you to? Because, because at first you said when we were talking before you were like, oh, no.

But then, you know, before we started talking, you're like, oh no. I'm very much vocal against the school system and my kids know it. How did we get them back into school?

Dena Farash: 00:14:01

Yeah, that's a great question. So I think one of the hardest realizations I had to come to for myself at the time was that I was not a very good homeschool mom.

That was just our reality.

I had, I, I lacked a certain level of patience that I, that I came to understand that my children really deserved when it came to their learning experience because I just wanted them to get it instantly and because I really didn't have my own skills and tools to help nurture that for them in the appropriate manner. I really could have used you guys during that time. Right.

Because I felt the heavy weight of the pressure of making sure my children were still at grade appropriate level. Right.

And that was a societal pressure, pressure from our families who didn't understand the choices we were making and weren't necessarily behind it. And so my rigidness really made the experience that much worse. And it's always so painful to say as a mom. Right. Like, similar in my own journey when.

When coming into parenting and being able to teach it and share about it, it's a really. It's a really, really hard look in the mirror to say, this isn't working for us, and I'm the reason it's not working.

So from there, we went to an alternative learning center, which was fabulous, but there was a tremendous sacrifice because it came with a very large price tag, you know, And. And the reality was sustaining a full homeschool atmosphere in our home without. Without using outside sources was not something I was able to manage.

Right. So we needed to turn somewhere. I wish I had known about you guys all those years ago, because you would have been a fantastic resource. Right.

And not even for my kids, for me. Right. To help me process what's happening and that learning looks differently for each. Each child.

And I only had my own experiences of school to fall back on, and school came very easily for me. So that. That really privileged perspective was very tough to translate when I was trying to teach my children who were different learners than I was.

Kristina: 00:16:05

Yeah.

Herb: 00:16:05

Yeah.

That's actually one of the things we talk about is actually the homeschool model is actually kind of broken too, because people bring their kids home and try and replicate the school system inside of the home. And we talk about how that's not really necessary. It's like, you have to learn what your kids like. You have to learn how your children learn.

And there's different times. It's not. It's not six hours or eight hours of education a day. It's.

It's sometimes like 20 minutes to an hour a day, but the play that they do afterwards supports their learning. And. And so it's not about creating a home school. It's about bringing education home, which is.

Kristina: 00:16:45

What we love to call it, which.

Herb: 00:16:47

Is what we call it, or bringing education home. And. And learning how to get your children to love learning. Because once they get that.

That love of learning going on, then everything they do starts pulling that in is like, oh, I want to learn about that. Oh, I want to learn about that.

And they bring it to themselves, and they start learning, doing the stuff that they love, instead of in a system where it's like, oh, now you have to do this, now you have to do that.

Dena Farash: 00:17:17

Right. No, I agree. You know, the crux of what if I were to go. Go back and look at how I could have done it differently.

I think my main objective would have been just to nurture that curiosity, like you're talking about. Right. And we did a lot of things. We were so fortunate to create community. We have.

Where I am in New Jersey, we have a rather large homeschooling community. And we were. We were connected with many people, so we did a lot of things.

And that's always when I felt the best, because I was outside, they were outside. They were. They were having connected experiences. You know, it's so interesting. So my son, my middle guy, was the first to go back to public school.

And I remember the feedback from his teacher was, everybody in this class loves when Ryan speaks. They think he thinks so differently. They. They love when he talks. And I remember asking her, do you think that's because he was homeschooled?

And she said, absolutely. And you said this perfectly earlier, because my son was never taught what he was never taught. He was never taught how to think. He. I'm sorry.

He was never taught what to think. He was taught how to think. Right.

And so now he comes into this class where these kids have been institutionalized in many ways since 3, 4 years old, and they're like, ryan asks such great questions. Oh, Ryan. Even though I wasn't the best homeschool mom, Ryan had the opportunity to ask questions, you know, and that's.

And that's not nurtured and supported in the public school system.

Herb: 00:18:41

Yeah.

It's interesting you say that, because right now, colleges are heavily recruiting from the homeschool population because of that, because they don't have to hold their hands, and they're so independent.

And so even though it was only for a couple of years and they did go back, you gave them a different foundation so that they go into that system understanding how to learn.

Dena Farash: 00:19:01

Right.

Herb: 00:19:02

Instead of. Instead of just, oh, I have to do this, I have to do this, and I can't wait for recess, and I can't wait till I go home and.

And looking for the breaks instead of. Instead of using it as an educational opportunity.

Dena Farash: 00:19:15

Yeah. It's so interesting, because my youngest. And this makes me sad a little bit, but it's just where we are for this moment.

My youngest is in kindergarten in public school, and my children are bright. Thank God they're bright and healthy.

But the biggest issue I have now, seeing her come home, is not necessarily how they're boxed in with the education. It is the level of different behaviors they are taught to believe are normal because the teacher just has to move forward.

Even though these two kids are extremely disruptive. The teacher still has to move on because she has objectives she has to hit.

And now my child, who emotionally understands that what this child is doing is not appropriate for the classroom, has to make sense somehow and resonate within herself. Why are they doing this and why is this accepted? And I.

And it's another point of struggle for me because I don't know how to address it to a five year old. Right.

Herb: 00:20:13

Right.

Kristina: 00:20:13

And that was one of the hardest things for me in the classroom.

And one of the reasons I had to leave was because I felt like I was failing the rest of the class because I spent so much time addressing those behaviors or addressing those kiddos who were outside of the box or the ones who weren't integrating who weren't a good fit for the classroom. Right. And so then that pull of I'm failing everybody else and I can't teach because this kid is constantly interrupting. Yeah.

And there's not enough services and support to get that kid what they really need. Yeah.

Herb: 00:20:48

And that's her inside polite, the way of saying that sometimes there were kids in the class who would pick up chairs and throw chairs and. And rip all the stuff off the wall.

And instead of getting help and support to deal with that behavior, she had to pull all of her kids out of the classroom and leave until that kids and other people would come in and basically watch this kid destroy her room because they weren't allowed to touch the kid or interfere because it might hurt the children's psyche or whatever.

So all these other kids had to watch that exit the room, lose their educational opportunities, and then be expected to still be caught up and pass the test on page 15 on this day. So it was, it was ridiculous. And so I was, I was getting angry hearing it from the outside.

So her being on the inside and that's again, that was part of the impetus. So it's not necessarily the teachers, it's the system and the way the edge the administration now is so afraid of the children.

Dena Farash: 00:21:49

Yeah. Well, I think they're scared of the parents and they're scared of the government. Right.

At least in my state, the school system is heavily run by our state government. And the problem I have is that we're normalizing traumatic behaviors for children who are not. Who are not used to being confronted with these things.

Like I shared, you know, when we. We spent the first few minutes talking about. I am so grateful for my marriage and the safety and the stability of my home.

And I know not every child has that. And so when These children are in public school and they're acting out because. And it's not the children's fault ever, ever.

But when they're acting out and now my child who does come from a safe and st is witnessing it, it is absolutely traumatic. And the things that she is going to grow up to see as normal really are not normal.

Kristina: 00:22:38

Right. Yeah. So I guess where I would go there is just really encourage you.

I know you didn't really ask, but just really encourage you to have those conversations with her. Are you feeling safe? Is there anything I can do to help this be better? Is there something you want to talk about with me?

Because you aren't understanding. So just really, really, you know, have those conversations and quiet places and listen when she is sharing. Yeah, yeah.

Dena Farash: 00:23:02

Thank you.

Kristina: 00:23:04

Exactly.

So one of the things I wanted to touch on a little bit is as you were moving through these different phases, did you actually wait for like the end of the semester or end of the school year or did you say, oh, you know what, I know this change needs to happen, I'm just going to do it kind of in the middle. I'm kind of setting you up for an answer here, but I want to hear what you did.

Dena Farash: 00:23:22

Yeah. So Covid was our impetus. Covid was the reason why we pulled our children from the public school system.

And I, I gave my daughters, my oldest daughter's teacher, as much grace as I could because it was a scary time and everybody was navigating it the best that they absolutely could. But I felt like my daughter's teacher, who at the time was a 20 plus year teacher, really lacked the perspective of the student.

And I really, really took issue with that. I understand that as an adult I can be compassionate and empathetic and say logically, you don't know what, you don't.

None of us can predict what's happening next. However, you cannot go no contact with my child for two months and then expect her to show up on a zoom for an assessment.

And there were little things like that that I just thought were so off the charts, especially for an educator of two decades to.

Even though you know the zoom classrooms and all those things were brand new, but to not understand that my child has not seen you heard your voice or had any sight type of touch point. And then because it's the end of the year and you want to assess where she is, she needs to perform for you. I just thought that was so off base.

Kristina: 00:24:37

Yeah, that was one of those things that was really, really tough.

And I can go into all the, you know, all the technology was really hard and all of that kind of stuff, but it really takes somebody who is really in tune to make that happen. I knew that was one of the hardest things that I was going through, was showing up and saying, hey, kiddos, now I really need you to read to me.

When maybe they hadn't been in contact with me as much. And that was super hard.

But, you know, it's one of those things that I always made sure I made that connection before I even asked any of those questions. How are you doing? Let's sing a silly song. Let's do something to reconnect and make sure that we're okay.

Before I start asking you a whole bunch of questions.

Dena Farash: 00:25:16

Right? And listen, I don't want to blame the teacher fully. The teacher did the best they could. There were no rules. There was no rhetoric.

There was no, like, rubric of what to do next. But then it's.

It's the end of May, and the district wants assessments, and so we've missed a lot of pieces from the child's perspective, which I think happens often in the public school system. We miss looking at things from the child's perspective or from a family perspective.

You know, the fact that parents aren't even allowed to walk into schools is another one of my huge, huge issues. Right. Like, what do you mean that my children are walking into a building that I physically cannot enter for eight hours? You know, to me, it's just.

It's just beyond my understanding. It's.

It's outside of my family's values, and it's outside of the things that I want to pass down to my children, which makes it even more odd and strange that I've officially entered us all back into that institution. And that was really hard, too. But it's.

Kristina: 00:26:15

It's.

Dena Farash: 00:26:15

It was a decision that we needed to make, at least for this moment, and I needed to find grace for my own self or being able to shift and leave the door open for more shifts.

Herb: 00:26:27

So how long were they homeschooled? Were they out? Were they out of school before they ended up going back in?

Dena Farash: 00:26:34

Four years.

Herb: 00:26:37

And so in those four years, that the independence that they got, the two oldest now. Have you. So you talked about your son. How is your daughter? Is it the daughter? Your oldest?

Dena Farash: 00:26:49

My oldest, yeah.

Herb: 00:26:50

How is your oldest daughter going back into the system? And how is she handling it?

Dena Farash: 00:26:55

She's flourishing, to be honest with you.

This year was a very interesting year for me because I just looked at it as I'm Just going to collect data to see how the education she's had so far compares to the public school education.

And listen, I'd be lying if I'd say that wasn't always in the back of my mind, only because I've been indoctrinated to believe that school was the only way. Right. And so I was very curious how she was going to do Right.

Essentially perform, knowing that she's, she's worked off different curriculums for, for really her pivotal elementary years. But I will say the positive thing, because I don't just want to bash the institution that I'm electively being a part of.

The positive thing, at least for my oldest, and what I really, really, really, really wanted for her was to have opportunities where she could lean into things that she loved. And in our life, the way it was set up and the way our money was being spent in alternative learning, I was saying no a lot. Right.

And so the positive thing about her being in public school is that she does have chances now to explore things like a yearbook club or the drama club or chorus and things that we didn't have the access or the time or the resources to provide for our children when they were home with us full time.

Herb: 00:28:12

So are those part of the school curriculum or are those after school activities?

Dena Farash: 00:28:16

Both. It's a mix of both. But I will say, like, she's been able to lean into the things that do excite her.

And so for me, that's all I wanted, at least for my oldest experience was for her to have the opportunities to spread her wings a little bit and really take advantage of some of the things that the public school system does offer that homeschooling didn't allow for us.

Herb: 00:28:40

So.

So if and when you do decide to pull them out again, one of the really interesting things is that school districts usually are mandated to take their, the homeschool children in for after school programs and sports programs.

So a lot of this chorus and, and stuff and, and yearbook, well, maybe not necessarily yearbook, but drama and sports, you can go back to the school for those activities. Yeah, for after school activities while you're still homeschooling your children.

So that is a way to, to get the access to that without actually having to pay more. So just, just that's a thought to keep in the back of your mind now.

Dena Farash: 00:29:19

Yeah, I appreciate that.

So that is such a good point because I think that's a place of fear that a lot of people wanting to make this transition have the way it works in my state and I'M in New Jersey is that every district is able to decide for themselves if they are willing to accept homeschool kids that live in the district. And it really changes from one town to the next. The town to the left of me does not allow homeschool kids to participate in after school activities.

The town to the right of me does. And so it's. It's just really interesting, I think. I mean, not that. Not that we were going to talk about this.

I think it's just really interesting, regardless of where you stand on education, to be involved with your local board of education and have a touch point on what's happening in the public schools in your town.

Kristina: 00:30:01

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And that goes back. You know, that kind of support is really super important.

And then also kind of, I wanted to go back to that other question of when you took them out because I wanted to really impress on people that you can make the choice of pulling your child out whenever. Right. It doesn't have to be at a semester at the end of the year. It can be whenever. It's a good fit for you and your family.

And, you know, the school district doesn't have a lot of say about that if you're following all the rules, filling out the paperwork, et cetera. So. Right.

Dena Farash: 00:30:33

And they might trick you into thinking that they do with lots of fear based tactics. But I have found in my own experience it really.

And it's not intentional on their part, it just comes from a lack of understanding and a lack of knowledge of what the policies actually are.

Because I've seen even in some local Facebook groups on the part of, you know, administrators giving parents the riot act when they have absolutely no right. When they have absolutely no right. And I don't think it's personal or intentional. I think they just don't know. Right.

Herb: 00:32:43

You know, I. I think it's probably based in their best of intentions because they're totally indoctrinated into the school system.

Which also is really weird because just like two weeks ago we found out that one of her principals from way back when actually homeschooled their children while they were principal. And she just found out about that. And it was like, what, you homeschooled your child while.

Kristina: 00:33:05

While you're an administrat school. Right.

Dena Farash: 00:33:08

So, yeah, that's interesting.

You know, I think, I think what we don't realize as parents and why this is such a tough decision even with dealing with the institutions of the public school is that every child that we allow going to these schools has A dollar sign above their heads.

Kristina: 00:33:21

Yes.

Dena Farash: 00:33:21

And we.

And we have to understand that as parents, and we have to understand that administrators are always seeing their school population from that perspective. Not that they didn't start in education with.

Well, intentions, but when you get to that place of administration, you're looking at the dollars and the cents of every single child. I'll just share with you. I had a. So my daughter just started this new school, and she's been out of public school systems since kindergarten.

And she has this technology teacher, and she's in the enrichment classes. And I just ran into the technology teacher at the supermarket who looked right at me and said, what do you think about. About the town's schools?

And I, you know, a big smile came on my face. I said, that's a very loaded question. And she looked right at me and she said, do not put them in this high school. And I said, thank you for that.

Because she knows. She knows a little bit of my daughter's educational history. My daughter advocates for herself, thank goodness. And she shares with her teachers.

This is my first year back in public school. And this teacher's perspective, who also raised three children in my town, is the school she's in right now is fantastic.

Do not put her in the height school.

Kristina: 00:34:27

Yeah. And thank you. Yeah. Thank that teacher again. And that was. The things that I did. I. That was hard.

One of the hardest discussions I ever had with the family. I brought them in, I closed the door, and I looked at them and said, I am doing the absolute best I can for your child.

But looking forward, you might consider this and this. Because what's happening for your child is not the best for them. And that parent, they thanked me so much.

But of course, the principal had walked by and the counselor had walked by, and they're like, oh, what are you talking about? And luckily, the parent had my back. They're like, it was a private discussion. You don't need to know what was being said.

Dena Farash: 00:35:02

So not. Public school is really not right for every child, especially the children that are struggling.

And parents are scared and not empowered enough to make those bold and brave decisions for themselves. And so I can have a lot of compassion, empathy. Thank goodness that's not my children's experience.

Kristina: 00:35:18

Yeah.

Dena Farash: 00:35:19

Because I am very vocal and I do show up to those board of ed meetings, but I have.

I have a lot of empathy and compassion for the parents who feel stuck and don't feel empowered enough to make those choices, which is why they need you guys as well.

Kristina: 00:35:33

Yeah.

Herb: 00:35:34

So we talked about how your children, how your daughter. Her teacher came and said, don't go into this high school. But how is she doing now?

Kristina: 00:35:41

She, she.

Dena Farash: 00:35:43

Yeah, my oldest is doing great. My oldest is absolutely, absolutely doing great. I'm so proud of her. Every single day. She walks right in. She is friendly.

She has a great little group of girlfriends. The teachers love her because she's got to spend her formative years working on her character and not just circling.

And not just circling multiple choice tests. Right. And being fearful of a grade that was going to come back.

So I'm grateful that she had those foundational years to build up her curiosity, her ability to connect with other children and more importantly, other children of other ages. I was just sharing this with my husband about my son, too.

My son can walk into any room in any situation because those formative, foundational years, there were times he was with a child two years younger than him. There was times he was with a child three years older than him. And so he's not scared. My children are not scared. Scared of children.

They know how to make the best of every situation because they kind, they kind of had to. They weren't just with their age group, they were learning from younger kids. They were being guided by older kids. Right.

And so they feel safe with other human beings regardless of what school they go to, what age they are, any things that really don't matter.

Kristina: 00:36:59

Yeah.

Herb: 00:36:59

So it's interesting how in the public education system and one of the biggest things that we get is, oh, well, they're not going to be properly socialized with children of their own age. And that, to me, that's like, well, awesome.

So, you know, because you said that your kid can just walk in and talk with anybody in different ages, but in school they're like classified by age groups and they're like, oh, you go to recess with this group, you go to lunch with this group, you never. So, yeah, that's. That's a really. Again, a point that we make.

And you just like, just, just like threw it out there, like, oh, yeah, this is an awesome part of it.

Dena Farash: 00:37:35

Yeah. And isn't so interesting that as a society we've defined socialization as sitting at a desk for eight hours a day. Right.

Not being able to get up and speak to our friends or give them a hug or share a pencil. Right.

Herb: 00:37:47

And we've said, quit talking, sit still.

Dena Farash: 00:37:49

Right. Exactly. And we're calling that socialization. And that is so bizarre to me.

only let children outside for: 1515

Kristina: 00:37:59

Yeah.

Herb: 00:37:59

You pin them all up with all of this energy, and then you put them outside in groups of a hundred with one or two people watching them. And this is where the most traumatic BS that ever happens in a person's life happens.

Because you have hundreds of people who aren't schooled in education or in communication, who don't have, you know, emotional stability yet. And that is how you socialize kids. It's like that to me. That's absolutely ridiculous.

And, you know, you talked about meditation, and that is a whole nother area of life that most people forget about.

Dena Farash: 00:38:35

Yeah.

And listen, I know that I've made an uncomfortable choice for myself, but the reality is, and you're touching upon it so beautifully, is that public schools don't prioritize connection. They prioritize compliance.

And the compliant kids are the good kids, and the kids that just need extra care, compassion, and connection are the bad kids. And so I. I even recognize this.

Prior to pulling my kids, my daughter in kindergarten was coming home always talking to me about the bad kid, the bad kid, the bad, you know, the loud kid. And I. Even then, even then, before I re.

Before I even foresaw our path, I was calling the superintendent and I was saying, this child is in kindergarten and he had not my child because my child is a compliant kid. My oldest, at least we all get one. I feel like we all get one.

But this poor child has another 12 years of education, and my child already believes that he's the bad kid. So what is this poor child thinking about himself and the way he's able to learn and the way he's able to be a human being?

A five year old, a six year old in a classroom.

Kristina: 00:39:37

Exactly. Yeah. And that's so, so important. So let's shift a little bit as your other role that you've been doing.

So thank you for sharing and being so vulnerable about your schooling and education journey for your children. But now you're also helping parents. Just tell us a little bit about how you help them and make sure that we know. Yeah. About that.

Dena Farash: 00:39:57

Yeah. I believe that the crux of every happy household is a fulfilled mom.

And so really my purpose and passion is helping mothers find their own fulfillment while being able to prioritize being a mom first.

I was fortunate enough to figure out how to do that in the digital space, and now I'm so blessed to be able to do that for other moms that want to create, that want to contribute to their homes.

Kristina: 00:40:22

Right.

Dena Farash: 00:40:23

And want to figure out how else they can be of service outside of motherhood while being able to still go to. If their kids are in public school, to still go to school events, to still work around a homeschool schedule. Right.

And so what I'm able to do now is teach moms how to utilize the digital space for an additional purpose, passion and income stream for their home.

Herb: 00:40:45

Yeah. When you first started talking about that and.

And earlier in our conversation, when you were talking about how you were having problems, one of the memes that came into my head was, happy wife, happy life. And that while that is true, that is also loaded at the same time, because it's not just about happiness. It's not just about keeping that calm.

It's actually about building a fulfilling life. And so, you know, again, a lot of guys will check out, it's like, oh, my wife's not happy. Just kind of step away from it. So how.

How do you build that empowerment and take it more than just, oh, happy wife, happy life? How do you. How do you help build that?

Dena Farash: 00:41:27

Yeah, I think this is a great question. It's something I think about and talk about a lot.

But I think the disconnect for most families, for most moms, is that they're very out of touch with what their actual values are. Right. We're so inundated by the noise from the outside space, from social media and so many women.

I can only speak from my perspective, a mom's perspective. Moms don't sit down to actually figure out what they value and what they prioritize.

And so we're just running this rat race without actually ever saying, hey, does that really feel good inside of me? Or taking the moment to say, that doesn't feel good inside of me. Why am I doing it anyway? Why am I doing it anyway?

But all of our power comes from understanding what our values are and living in alignment with that. And that, to me, always is the first step. Figure out what you actually care about, what is important to you.

You know, I can tell you with ease, the most important things in my parenting are raising resilient human beings. That is. That is my top. That's my top tier. That at the end of the day, I'm not trying to be a perfect mom.

I know I'm not always going to make my children happy. I'm absolutely going to disappoint them because we're human beings in a relationship.

But my number one goal when it comes to parenting is to raise resilient, confident human beings.

Kristina: 00:42:43

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Because that is basically the first step we take our families through as well. When families start working with us.

The very first session is let's look at your values. Look. Look at your family goals, your family values. How do you want to build this relationship with homeschool, with education at home?

Because you need that foundation to help boost you up on those hard days and to keep moving you forward and letting you know if you're hitting the target you really want for you and your family.

Herb: 00:43:12

And step two is that then looking at your actions are. Is what you're doing, matching. Matching what you're saying and writing down as. As your top priorities.

Because if your top priority is your family, but all of this other stuff is where your. Is where your focus lies, then you're not living your values. And that does create a discordance, that does create a.

A barrier to reaching your children in the communication that you're so trying to talk about. So, yeah, that's really important.

Dena Farash: 00:43:44

Yeah. And we're in a time where we just outsource that stuff. We outsource our values just like the same way out we.

The same way we outsource our children's education. Right. Like, we believe that it's not for us to take care of. The world will just tell us how it's supposed to unfold.

And so we ignore these parts inside of us that are like, this is. This is not feeling right for me.

Herb: 00:44:04

Yeah. And, you know, it's me. It goes a little beyond that, too.

So here's the out of the box stuff again is, you know, our media, our news, all of the TV shows are all about women in their careers and about how the dads are kind of dumb and unuseless and unnecessary. And, you know, women need to do this and be this and that.

And so then this idea of raising the children, of being the person who creates that life and builds that up, is, like, almost demonized. Like, how could you just want to be a mom? And so there's also that added pressure of what's the societal.

I wouldn't even call it norms, because I don't think it's normal. I think it's like a vocal minority that's really pushing that in a way to destabilize what we actually have. So, again, how do you.

How do you work with that? Because of the brainwashing that's going on not in just social media, but all media right now?

Dena Farash: 00:45:04

Yeah. Well, first of all, I. I agree. Right.

I think it's not the biological norm, you know, and I think every Woman should feel empowered to make the decision that's right for her. Every mom, if you want to be a career mom, absolutely, go ahead.

There's no judgment, but if you ask me, like really skin deep, I don't think that that's a biological norm for women. Right. And I think so much has changed when we created an economy based on a two person full time income. Right.

We, we told people to buy houses based on two incomes. And so a woman who has a baby and I, I have hands on experience with this as well.

A woman who has a baby and it gets, gets, is given, you know, her wonderful eight weeks and then is absolutely heartbroken when she has to go back to work. Work, but can't rationalize.

The fact that she has student loans now that she has a mortgage that requires two salaries, is put in a very uncomfortable and difficult position where she knows biologically where she wants to be, but societally, right. And through the banks and the financial institutions we have here, she literally cannot make that decision.

And I think women from the onset of motherhood are not given that choice to ever ask themselves what feels right for me and my family and what feels right for the future of how I want to raise these kids. It's sad.

Kristina: 00:46:23

It's really sad. So true, so true. Because I felt stuck like that.

Even, you know, 20 at the beginning of my teaching career, you know, 30 years ago, it's like, I want to be a teacher, but at the same time, once I had kids, it's like, oh, wait a second, it might be better if I stayed home and homeschooled, etc. But then I was like stuck, you know, because like you said, the house, we'd gotten into a house and all of these different things. So.

Herb: 00:46:45

And it's really difficult to, again, to put your family values, to write out those values and then to live them. So if that is your family value, then are you prioritizing your house? Are you prioritizing your job? Can you downsize?

Can you give up your, your lifestyle to actually live your values? And that is something that most people have so much trouble even contemplating that, hey, you know what, we can downsize.

We can move into a smaller house. We don't have to keep up and that. Yeah, so that's, that's amazing.

Kristina: 00:47:22

Yeah.

Dena Farash: 00:47:22

Yeah, it's a tough pill to swallow. And I, and I have a tremendous amount of compassion and empathy for, for women and families that are in that position.

But I agree, it's, it's really hard.

Kristina: 00:47:32

Yeah. And that's why part of the reason we're here also at Byron Family Education is because we want to help families step through that. What?

You know, give us suggestions, give ideas, what can be done. Right. So even if you can't homeschool, how can you support your child's education in another way? Dina, this has been such an amazing conversation.

Thank you so very, very much. I feel we could keep going, but we really do need to wrap up because you probably have another meeting, and our audience has been listening.

This has been so awesome. Thank you for being vulnerable. Thank you for sharing the ins and outs of that education experience.

Thank you for the support that you are giving to parents and families right now in this trans. In this change and making things better for them.

Dena Farash: 00:48:12

Yeah. Thanks to you guys for supporting parents and making decisions that they are not comfortable doing at first. Very important.

Herb: 00:48:20

So as we are wrapping up, is there something that you would have liked to have talked about? Is there something that you would have liked to say to our audience that maybe we haven't got to.

Dena Farash: 00:48:29

You know, I think how I'll end it. Because you touched upon this keeping up with the Joneses type of mentality. Right.

And I think what I want to share most importantly was that the toughest decision when my children went back to public school was not actually entering them into the school. It was telling my friends. Right. And I was not scared of anything more than I was about the judgment of now, my homeschool community. Right.

And that was really, really tough.

And so we just have to continue to encourage ourselves to be brave and make the decisions that are right for our family in the moment and know that we can always change those choices.

Herb: 00:49:06

Well, wow. I don't necessarily want to prolong this, but how did your homeschooling family take it? Were they. Were they understanding and acceptable?

Was your fear of judgment actually verified or vilified?

Dena Farash: 00:49:19

You know, at least to my face. So my homeschool community over the years got smaller and smaller and smaller because as we do, we're not meant to.

We're not all meant to be in each other's lives forever. So the very good friends that I had supported me. Right? At least to my face. And they're still in my lives, and they're still in my children's lives.

So there are. There are friends, family forever. But for sure, that was the scariest part of me.

Like, how am I going to tell these women that I advocated with and that I fought with for so long that we were now making a different choice? And.

Herb: 00:49:50

And you fought with or Fought beside.

Dena Farash: 00:49:52

Thank you. Thank you. Fought beside. Yeah, yeah. No, thank you. Thank you for that clarification. Yeah, that I fought beside.

You know, we were in it together, and to be that person that makes the different choices is really scary.

Kristina: 00:50:05

Yeah, absolutely. Thank you so very much.

And also make sure you drop some information about how parents can get a hold of you if they're looking for the support that you're offering. If you've said something that really sparks their interest, how can they get a hold of you? How can they get in touch?

Dena Farash: 00:50:19

Yep. So I share the most, and I share very regularly, all the time on Facebook.

You can find me at Dina Farish and you can visit my website, dina Farish dot com.

Kristina: 00:50:28

Excellent. All this stuff will be down in the show notes as well.

Thank you so much again for being vulnerable, for sharing, and I feel very inspiring, you know, letting parents really know that it's okay to kind of go in and out and make the best choice for your family as it is needed. So, families, audience, thank you for being with us today.

Thank you for listening and making sure you're taking notes and picking up those nuggets of gold and taking them with you and then putting them into action. Action as we move forward in our life to make our kids happy, healthy, and successful.

Herb: 00:50:57

And thank you for being here. It was a wonderful conversation. It. It really touched on a lot of things and.

And you spoke so eloquent, eloquently about some really sensitive topics and. And how you got into this. So thank you for being here. Thank you for. For. For making this part of your life and for sharing that life with.

With the rest of us out here.

Dena Farash: 00:51:15

So thanks for the opportunity.

Kristina: 00:51:17

Thanks for having me, guys. All right, audience, until next time. Bye for now.

Herb: 00:51:22

Bye for now.